Calligraphy Biz Corner

24. Top 2025 Wedding Trends with Desirée Adams of Verve Event Co.

• Alane Gianetti, Shaochen Wu • Season 1 • Episode 25

Share episode

In this episode of Calligraphy Biz Corner, we chat with luxury wedding planner Desirée, owner of Verve Event Co. and host of the Ask the Planner podcast, about upcoming 2025 wedding trends and the creative possibilities they open up for calligraphers. From the Pantone color of the year to the rising popularity of live engraving, Desirée shares fresh ideas to elevate your wedding services and position yourself as a trend-savvy pro.

In this episode, we’ll dive into:

  • Where to Find Inspiration for 2025 Wedding Trends: Desirée spills her favorite sources (and her process) for spotting what’s next in the wedding world.
  • Accuracy of Trend Forecasts: Learn how to gauge which predictions will truly resonate with couples and how to filter out the fluff.
  • 2025 Wedding Trend Predictions: Desirée highlights eight of her favorite trends to talk to your clients about this year!
  • Pantone’s Color of the Year: We talk about how it might shape 2025 celebrations, and how you can use color trends to enrich your offerings.
  • Incorporating Calligraphy & Live Engraving into Trends: Desirée shares ideas for how to incorporate calligraphy details and experiences into popular wedding trends. 
  • Becoming a Thought Leader: Discover why positioning yourself as an expert (beyond just your industry bubble) sets your brand apart.

If you're a wedding vendor or creative entrepreneur looking to get ahead of the latest wedding trends, this chat with Desirée is packed with actionable ideas to help you stand out!

🔗 Links to resources mentioned in this episode:

Text us a question to answer on a future episode!

Support the show

👯‍♀️ Learn More About Us:

alane_3_01-08-2025_140248:

Hello and welcome back to Calligraphy Biz Corner and happy new year. We completely forgot to wish you all a happy new year on our last episode because we recorded it before Christmas even. So I feel like we were not in. The new year, new energy mindset just yet. So we hope that your 2025 is off to a fantastic start. I'm Elaine.

shaochen_3_01-08-2025_120248:

And I'm Xiao Chen. And we're super excited to bring you our first guest episode of the year with the first wedding planner that we've had on this podcast, since we're in peak wedding inquiry season right now. So we thought it would be a great time to bring on a planner and chat all about trends for 2025 and man, Desiree came prepared. I think she shared like eight or nine wedding trends with us. So you'll definitely want to tune into this episode. She also talks about where she looks for trends and inspiration. And then most importantly, as a calligrapher, how we can incorporate trends whether the ones she identified or other ones that we see into conversations with our clients.

alane_3_01-08-2025_140248:

Yeah. So Desiree and I got connected in the fall of 2024 and it was, it was actually perfect timing because I feel like we were starting to think about what episodes do we want for 2025? We knew we wanted to have a planner on to chat with us about wedding trends um, but we weren't sure who, and so we got introduced and then I was actually a guest on her podcast, Ask the Planner in November. We can link to that episode in the show notes in case anybody wants to go take a listen, but we just had so much fun chatting all about wedding signage and, Calligraphy. And kind of like Xiao Chen said, after we finished recording our episode with her, she's just, she's so easy to talk to. She's so sweet and down to earth, but like also such a boss lady.

shaochen_3_01-08-2025_120248:

Yeah.

alane_3_01-08-2025_140248:

So we just knew like, after I chatted with her on her podcast, I was like, I think I found our planner for calligraphy biz corner. So we were super excited that she was able to join us today.

shaochen_3_01-08-2025_120248:

And so as we kind of reflect back about the recording that we just had with Desiree, we wanted to share some of our like takeaways for you to keep an eye out for too, as you listen. One thing that really I noticed as she was talking throughout the interview and probably contributes to why she's such a boss is that she's always talking about and thinking about how you can position yourself as a thought leader or how you can showcase yourself as a leader. the expert in what you do in your industry as a calligrapher or creative, whatever business you might have. And throughout the episode, I want you just to listen for that when she talks about, you know, when she kind of gives those suggestions of like, here's how you can position yourself as a thought leader and showcase that for your clients. We all have imposter syndrome, right? I hear it so much from calligraphers that I talk to, because especially working in the wedding industry, there's a lot of elements of a wedding that we might not be familiar with, but just remember that like, You are the expert at your specific craft. You don't have to be the expert at every single aspect of the wedding, right? But someone is hiring you because they trust you for this element of their wedding. So you want to make sure that you're showcasing yourself as the expert and asking the right questions to your clients. And that's something that we talk a little bit about in this episode.

alane_3_01-08-2025_140248:

Yeah, absolutely. I completely agree with you. I love how much she was framing things as that thought leadership and like really positioning yourself as the expert and kind of authority figure for your industry. Cause I agree with you that like, I think as calligraphers, there's a lot of imposter syndrome and I know for me personally, it took me a long time Feel comfortable and confident pitching ideas to my clients and like making suggestions and positioning myself as that, you know, kind of guide in their wedding calligraphy process. But that is what they're coming to you for. And as you go on in your business, you're going to have experience built up that all. Feeds into your expertise. So just piggybacking off of what you said, like definitely keep your eyes or your, keep your ears open for those moments within the show, and just take this as the permission that. Maybe you need it or maybe you didn't need to step into your expertise. Kind of, again, like tying into that, one of my favorite takeaways was in the very beginning, but it kind of went throughout the episode as well. Was, you know, when you're thinking of ideas, creative designs for weddings, things like that, even looking at trends to look outside of your niche and outside of your industry. And one of my favorite things that she said was that she doesn't follow that many planners on Instagram because she wants a more, I guess, a wider variety of influences on her social media feed for gathering ideas and inspiration. And I know I follow a ton of calligraphers on my Instagram and it is inspiring. And I absolutely love connecting with the people in our community, but at the same time, you don't want that to kind of cloud your vision or. You're intaking so much that people in your industry are doing that you just start to copy them rather than come up with your own creative ideas. So I guess also take this as permission to, you don't necessarily need to unfollow people if you don't want to unfollow people, but you can mute people from time to time. So if you're feeling like your social media or where you're gathering inspiration from is overrun by calligraphers, then we both strongly encourage you to. Diversify that a little bit.

shaochen_3_01-08-2025_120248:

Yeah. We talked a little bit about how Instagram can be like an echo chamber too. So definitely if you're like, You're all your contents the same. It's very homogenous. You're just seeing the same stuff over and over. And when we're talking about the topic of trends, part of it's about identifying things that other people aren't doing yet. It's about things that aren't overdone yet. And so I love this idea of finding inspiration in other places. Before I read Desiree's intro, just a quick note to our listeners that if you listened to the Empowered CEO episode right before this, that was a series and we will be continuing that series after this episode. So about Desiree, she is a luxury wedding planner, educator, and host of the Ask the Planner wedding and event planning podcast. Her work has been seen in the Today Show, New York Magazine, Inspired by This, Carrots and Cake, among others. She has also been featured on multiple podcasts, including The Power and Purpose, Consider the Wildflowers, The Big Wedding Planning Podcast, and The Wedpreneur. For Desiree, life is too short to waste it on moments that don't give you joy. As the CEO and Lead Event Designer at Verve Event Co., she and her team focus on operations, design, and execution, while also dreaming up the future. Thoughtful touches and design motifs that turn celebrations into heirloom occasions. As the host of the ask the planner podcast, she provides planners and couples with tangible tools and advice so that they can plan their milestones with precision and infuse it with their personal style. So let's turn it over to the interview.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Welcome Desiree to calligraphy Biz Corner. We are so excited to have you here. Thank you so much for joining us. You and I met in the fall and I was a guest on your podcast. So before we jump into our conversation today, For anyone who doesn't know you yet, can you just give our listeners a little intro as to who you are and what you do?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

yeah. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to chat with you all. So I am a wedding planner based in upstate New York. I also have a podcast, like you mentioned called ask the planner and we plan luxury wedding weekends for couples. primarily in the Northeast, but we also travel. So I'm so excited to chat about this exciting, fun topic.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

We thought you'd be the perfect person to bring on to talk about wedding trends, especially as a planner, you kind of see all aspects of the wedding. So we'd love to kick it off by asking you like, where do you look for wedding trends and wedding inspiration? And where would you recommend other wedding pros like ourselves to look for trends?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, I think this is a great question. You know, I think we talked about a little bit before we started recording, but I think we want to make a distinction first of what we were talking about when we say trend. You know, there's a difference between trendy and what's meaning what's catching people's eye and their attention. And then also what is this kind of like going on in the industry as a whole, we do a lot of custom work with our couples. So we don't necessarily just want to stick with what's trendy. A lot of our couples will say like, I want my wedding to be timeless. And I want it to look like, you know, I want to look back on it in 20 years and still be excited about it, which it's still going to look like you had it 20 years ago, because that's just the reality of it. We like to kind of be inspired by what is, what's exciting people and then take that and figure out how we can personalize it to each couple so that we're not just copying a table that we saw but really making it a thoughtful decision around it and, and using that inspiration for what people are doing and are excited about, and then incorporating it into our weddings. So to answer your question, I think the easiest and probably the most obvious one is Instagram. I try not to follow a lot of planners which may sound weird, but I try not to like look at what everyone else is doing because then I feel like I'll end up. Copying people, even if it's like subconscious, but there are definitely still some planners and designers that I admire and really respect. And I think they also can not be a beacon, but they definitely kind of have a touch point on like, what is trending or what new ways of doing things or looking at things or executing things, which I think is always makes you kind of think I'm going to pause and think, okay, that's a cool new way of doing something, whatever it is. And we'll talk about that in a little bit. Um, How can we incorporate that into our, into our work? So Instagram is one. I also like following other creative accounts in general, like fashion. or other brands also just to get inspiration from that. But also seeing like what's because I feel like a lot of the trends in other industries like textiles interior design also kind of feel into the wedding industry. It's all like colors for sure. It's typography. So even kind of getting an idea of what is going on in other creative industries is also important. It also keeps your work. I think fresh. From time to time I do read articles on major brand publications like Vogue, Harper's Bazaar, et cetera, just so that I'm not in my own little bubble of like, these are the people that I follow on Instagram and these are what everyone's doing, but really trying to figure out like what the wider audience is doing. I think it's important as a creative and as a business owner to think about where are your target clients. Looking also like where are they being inspired? Cause there's, there's a difference between what you like personally and what it's inspiring for you, but then also like what your potential customers are going to be inspired by and like where they're hanging out. So I think having that lens of where, you know, what they're excited about, what fashion do they like, et cetera will also help you with getting inspiration as well. And then the last place that I just wanted to know that I don't get inspiration from necessarily, but I still do use and go on is Pinterest. Only because I, I mean as a designer, as a business owner, wedding planner, I definitely utilize Pinterest, meaning I post on it a lot, you know, for SEO, et cetera. But I find that if I'm trying to get ideas and inspiration, Pinterest is not the best place to go because a lot of the pins are recycled. They're from several years ago. So if you want to know what has been overdone or is a trend that may be on its way out, sorry, Pinterest Maybe consider that because I feel like it's sometimes it's when like you see it a lot That's when you're like, okay, this is a trend It's been around for a while and maybe we want to avoid that even though like it might feel fresh to you It's been around a while if that makes sense.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

That's a really good point. I'm glad you kind of told us where not to look as well. But I love the, the point you made about the Instagram kind of being an echo chamber. So you want to include Instagram as an inspiration, but also other sources.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I guess one of my like biggest questions would be as we are. You know, starting to see what's, what's trending for 2025, we're looking on Instagram, we're, we're looking in other publications and all of these other kinds of creative outlets. How do we decide and how accurate do you typically find these various sources to be of like, what is trending? Cause I guess in a way I'm kind of like, well, if I just see a cool, you know, a cool tablescape on Instagram, like, am I automatically like, Ooh, that's a trend? Or is it only when I like start to see it more often? Cause also too, when you're like looking at, you know, say the knot just came out with like a 25 wedding trends posts. It's like, but 25, 25 just started. So like, how are they making these predictions too? I guess.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, no, I think that's a really good question. I think, I think you always have to take things with a grain of salt. I think all these businesses are businesses and they're marketers and they might have something to sell, whether it's an affiliate, whether it's a business. Like a partner that they already have a relationship with. So I think that's something that you should definitely consider when you're looking at what people are saying. You know, I think a lot of articles, some articles, sorry, not a lot, some articles will, will quote other planners or designers, and I think that can have some more accuracy in it because it's people that are actually in. The trenches and actually doing it or they have examples of what they've been doing, et cetera. But I think also you just have to think about, you know, is there an affiliate link that when you click on this trend that they talk about, are they getting money from it, which there's nothing wrong with that. I think, you know, they usually disclose it. But I think just thinking about, you know, if there's another agenda, yeah. I don't, I'm not saying that there's just saying it to, you know, to make money, I think they have an audience and they have like a wide reach because they probably are accurate, but I think just thinking about, you know, how, how they might be influenced is something to consider too.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, that's really helpful.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

So, in terms of identifying trend and looking at all these different sources, what about listening to your couples as a source of, like, you know, what's hot and what's coming?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, I think I think obviously like you all will agree first and foremost, we definitely want to listen to the couple and like what they're asking for and what they want. A lot of our couples will have maybe an idea of what they like. A lot of them will have a stronger idea of what they don't like, I think a lot of times. So it's our job as the planner to pull that out from them and really kind of get an idea of like, well, if you like this trend, Great. What is it about this trend that you like so that we can figure out how we can incorporate it into your design and not just copy something that we saw on Pinterest, right? I think, you know, figuring out what's exciting to them about it is helpful. And then personalizing it, which I think is what most couples want. I have had some couples like I have this one example where a couple was like, I really, really just want it. blush and burgundy. And this was like circa 2019. And I think you might guys remember that blush and burgundy trend. And I was like, I've seen this color combination a lot. I feel like we can incorporate this, but let's add some dusty blue. Let's add some other colors, some mob in there to kind of round it out and make it feel more personal to you. And not just like this. We've been seeing everywhere and she, she, she was on board and she was really excited. So, so I was like, thank goodness. But then like, I think like a month later, after I presented the design, she was like, I just went to a wedding, guess what their color palette was? Washington burgundy. And I was like, I told you this. And I was like, this is why, you know, it's really important to kind of see what's. Also on its way out. So you can figure out like, how do you want, how do you guide your couples so that they don't make a decision that they're going to later regret. I did have another bride who was like, I really just want green and gold. And it was an October wedding. And I was like, I think it's going to look like Christmas. And I showed her, you know, green and gold and ivory and like a little bit of blue just to kind of give it some more variety. She said yes initially, but then everything she chose was just green and gold. And I was like, well, you know, we tried and made her happy. She really liked it. And like, at the end of the day, that's all you can do. Like you can advise them and, and help them and show them your perspective, but they're the client. And so if that's what they want, that's what they want. You know, you just go on and make them happy.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yep, exactly. I feel like you can only, you can guide them so much. And then, and then that's it. I feel like we definitely have experiences as calligraphers, too, for making suggestions and just people being like, no, I just want to do this. And you're like, okay. Yep.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

for hearing me out.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Yeah, I think there's definitely this balance of it trending versus getting to the point where it's so trendy that it becomes overdone. But then to your point, it's sometimes it's still new to them, right?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

And I think, you know, I don't know how long of like a lifespan you have with your clients, depending on like when you start working with them, if it's from, from the state of the days on. I also find that sometimes couples tastes change during the planning process. So they can, you know, I don't always. put my foot down in the very beginning if they feel very strongly about something, I'll say, okay, great, like, we'll definitely consider that and take that into, you know, whatever, incorporate that into the design and then like, you know, we'll follow up on that thing, whatever it was throughout the planning process. And then usually at some point, they're like, you know, that time when you said X, you are right. And I actually have seen it a lot or like, I don't want to do it anymore, you know, whatever. And they're like, okay. And, but you know, they feel like they made that decision and sometimes they have to go through that. Experience or take that time to really see what else you know, because they're so new to it to really see what's going on and then. Decide maybe you're right or maybe not.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

A hundred percent.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

So switching gears a little bit into like forward thinking predictions, what trends are you seeing right now for 2025?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

So exciting. Okay. We have a lot. I have a lot that I, you know, put together in my little list. One of the first things that I think is really exciting that May not surprise you, but is the personalized touches. And I think personalized, interactive, immersive, like all of those things to keep the guests entertained. One of the things that people have, you know, been talking about lately is live engraving. You know, having that kind of interactive experience at an event, I think is really important. I think thinking about how it's going to be produced is important to consider as well. I was actually at an event. It was a conference. And they had live engraving at the conference. It was, you know, they had a little, not a booth, but they had a setup and there was somebody engraving luggage tags with your initials, which was really nice. And then I realized that the luggage tags were all Brown. And I was like, eh, actually, can you just make one for my husband? Cause Brown isn't my favorite. And I was like, it's not going to match anything. So just make one for my husband. He was also producing a lot for a lot of guests, and I feel like I got backed, backed up. So I feel like if you're doing something that is immersive or interactive, like sketching, live painting, late night pizza, ice cream, smorgasbord, like lots of these interactive things make sure you have enough space. staff to execute it. Just because, you know, if you are doing the live calligraphy on a hat or a jacket or shoes, I'm seeing, I saw recently, and I don't even, I have no idea if it's like a trend right now, but like she does. Stitching and embroidery on on canvas sneakers sounds like that is so cute. Not many people are going to have canvas sneakers, but but does the amount of time, whatever you're doing and how long it's going to take you to do that at an event, I think it's definitely something that you want to consider.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Well, as calligraphers, obviously we see a ton of live engraving, live calligraphy, life foiling, all of this, like live component now at weddings. So we are so excited that you brought this up as the very first thing you talked about. I mean, maybe we primed you a little bit in the interview guide for it, but hopefully it is your top trend. But I totally, totally agree. And actually, Alayna and I have been chatting in the background about planning an episode specific to interactive um, calligraphy at weddings, because I do think it is a little bit different than when you're at a conference or something corporate, because of that super personalized, not to mention, like, this is somebody's, like, big book. Big, big day, right? So I totally agree about like making sure the staffing is on point. We've also been talking with other calligraphers about when they work at weddings, they bring on assistance. And I think that's just absolutely a non negotiable to make sure that that whole experience is absolutely seamless for not just the couple, but all of their guests as well. And it may be even any like vendors, right? That you're interacting with on site.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, I think that's, I mean, I think calligraphy is so beautiful. It's, it's, it's, it's artwork to me. And so I think being able to expose the guests to that at the wedding, like this is the calligrapher who did the stationary and now she's here and she's going to do whatever I think just one has that full circle moment, but yeah, definitely. Make sure your staff up, Another trend that people are excited about or that I'm seeing more incorporated is these kind of restaurant style weddings where, or like a restaurant inspired wedding where people are having their weddings at really high end restaurants. That's, it's hard to get a reservation at, or even how like the restaurant kind of floor plan informs a floor plan in a tent or a space with a lot of space. So they'll have like banquettes and they'll have like multiple seating or Not arrangements, but type. So they'll have, you know, the round tables, the square tables, the rectangular tables, they have like, you know, lots of soft seating, and it really feels like you're in a restaurant. And not just a sea of all around tables, which I think is really, it's really beautiful. And I think it's just visually inspiring because there's like a lot of different texture and there's just a lot of different places to make it custom and make it feel different and add texture to the room. Another trend that I'm seeing that has been around for at least a little bit, but I don't think is going anywhere is sustainability. I feel like it's been a buzzword for a while. I'm hearing more and more that couples don't like to see waste, which I think is hard if you're in the wedding industry, because you're making things for one event, you know, for one day or for one weekend. But I think when we talk about sustainability, I think, Us as vendors, calligraphers, et cetera, need to just think about how we can because your calligraphy is going to go on something, whether it's paper, whether it's a sign, et cetera, thinking about how it's going to be able to be reused, or if you get the paper later, and you can recycle it, or like the paper that you use whatever it is. It's having something to show that you are thinking about this, that you have something in place to at least like reduce the waste or reuse it or even just try to like think of how something can live on again and not just a one time use, which I know is hard, but I feel like that's definitely not, I think couples. Consumers in general just want to feel good about their purchases. Like it's great if it's like, you know, whatever they want, but if they feel good, like they're doing good with their purchase, I feel like it's just like another added benefit that could distinguish you from somebody else.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

I love this point as well because it's something that I always think about and do struggle with too because you're trying to Create something that's like personal unique to them and at the same time try to make it Sustainable, right? And it, sometimes it feels contradictory, but a couple suggestions I'll put out there for like other calligraphers is this is where I find rentals to be really helpful. So sometimes like table numbers can be a little bit more, not generic, but things that people aren't as they don't need to be as customized necessarily. People are kind of okay with like, like, A neutral set that goes with their palette. So maybe you keep something like that in your rental inventory or having like some rental mirrors. I know calligraphers who have big acrylic pieces that they reuse. I also like the supplier that I purchased my acrylic from because I know that's a big concern with like plastic single use plastics. They recycle acrylic. So. Totally agree with you on this. And as calligraphers, like we should definitely be thinking about our part and how we can do this. And also like the piece about communicating it to your client. I noticed a lot of times that it's something I think about that's in my mind, but I need to do a better job of actually communicating that outwardly to my client.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I think you bring up a lot of really good points. And I think just kind of having it more in the forefront, you don't have to talk about all the time, but at least one having an answer prepared, but even like including it in some of the language that you have, or just inserting it in there in a post of like, you know, sometimes people ask us about X, Y, and Z. And like, this is a definite concern in our industry. And like, this is how we deal with it, or whatever, I think is it, it also like distinguish you, I think, from other people that aren't talking about it.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

yeah, exactly. And I feel like to piggyback off of all of this, like one thing that I tried to promote as well in like my messaging too, is this idea of sure, like maybe your welcome sign is only going to be used once for your wedding or your bar sign, but. Because you're hiring somebody who's creating something so custom. Like I'm always thinking of ways and sharing them with my clients of how can you reuse this after your wedding day? Like, how can we create a welcome sign that you want to display in your home afterwards? Or, I mean, bar signs are a huge one. People are always sending me pictures of like, look, here's my bar sign on my bar cart or like in my kitchen or something like that. And that's so nice. So on top of like the rentals and being able to reuse things. Things in that way are like being able to recycle materials. I also think thinking through as calligraphers specifically, how can we turn these pieces, these custom pieces into keepsakes that are going to be, you know, somewhere in their home or at a keepsake box or something long after the wedding day? Because people want to remember those occasions too.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah. I mean, I'm definitely one of the people that likes to hold on to things. So having those tactile items to help us remember these special events I think is, you know, I think it just, it, it kind of brings it home of like this, this was actually at our wedding and here's how we're using it now. So the next trend, I think that's really fun and kind of different is objects as invitations or even maybe as a state of the day, you know People like, like we said, things that are tactile and a couple of years ago, I feel like 10 years ago, 15 years ago, a lot of people were into like those invitation boxes and it was like this giant box that would come in and it has like all these different things. And I feel like this is kind of like the next iteration of that where People like, like I said, like the tactile thing. So having an object that's coming, that's being mailed a ship to people as their save the day or the invitation, I think just helps set the tone of like, this is something fun. It's also something you can use. What I think is kind of a nice, trend that people are excited about?

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

What objects have you seen? I'm so curious. My mind immediately goes to like the magnets. I feel like save the date magnets were really big I don't know how many years ago

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I would not, I would not be Magnus. No, I think. I think.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

and I was like, I feel like he's talking about something a little more elevated than a magnet

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I think it would be something. So the things that I think that are really fun would be things that relate to your destination or where you're getting married or what you're doing. So if it's like has a retro vibe, you can use those like, like those Retro hotel or motel key chains. If you, if it's something like Western, you could have something that's like rope or like braided. So that's something that's kind of like brings in that texture and that textile feeling. If it's something that's more beachy, it could be something like. I was saying like flat like a shell. It's just something I think to make it feel like you're not just getting a save the date with their photo on it and it's going to be like looking at you from your fridge for the next year, which is not my favorite.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Yeah, I feel like there's that moment of like surprise and delight, right, when you incorporate something unique like that.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Exactly. And I feel like your stationery or your invitation or your state of the day is like one of the first experiences you have with your guests. So it's really an opportunity for you to make an impression and to get them really excited. It's not just about like, Oh, here, like, this is what we're doing. It's really like, I want you to be excited because we're excited and you know, it's going to be a special time.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yep, absolutely. I'm so glad you made that point. Cause you know, I feel like we hear a lot as stationers and calligraphers like, Oh, the invites will just end up in the trash, so I'm not going to spend a lot of money on them. And of course, like there are all different budget ranges and there are options for all different budget ranges, but it's like, It's not just a piece of paper that's going to end up in the trash. Just like you said, it's really that first introduction to your wedding celebration and what your guests can expect. And it's setting the tone for everything that's to follow. So I'm glad that we have a planner.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, also, I think to that point, like, wouldn't you want to be the one that sends them something that they are going to keep? Like, yours is the one invitation, yours is the one piece of, like, envelope or whatever it is that they were like, this is so beautiful, I'm going to keep this.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

When I was looking at your website and your Instagram, I saw that you had so many beautiful detailed shots of invitations and like signage and other details and flowers, I was like, this is our person, she gets us.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I love it. I just love all. I mean, it's like, it's like picking my favorite child out. All of it is just so important. I think they all have their own little touches or their own little, it's like one giant jigsaw puzzle, right? Of like your day and your personalities and who they are as, as people and as a couple. And I feel like everything ties in together, but I love it when, you know, something from the state of the day is like brought back for the, for the wedding day. And it's like, yeah, You saw a little hint of it here where there was like a little sailboat or whatever. Like we, we did one where the couple got engaged on a sailboat. So the stationer and calligrapher, you know, drew the sailboat and then we had I think that was on like their say at the date and then like the sailboat was used in like the 12 pattern on their invitation. And then like the sailboat was again used on like their escort cards. And it was like a, Acrylic ornaments. But then like, that was something that people are going to keep because they'll, you know, most, not everyone celebrates Christmas, but like, it's something that, you know, people can hang and keep afterward, which I think is just, you know, I think it's fun. So I think the next trend, which is probably not going to surprise your listeners would be content creators. I think this is huge for not just couples in that, you know, who are getting married vendors who are on site, but also us. Just vendors, you know, people, service providers that are trying to market our businesses. I feel like having, and honestly just hiring a content creator. So yes, if you know, if you're at an event, you're doing live engraving or live foil or whatever, having someone to capture that I think is important. But I think, you know, even just the way we capture ourselves in the behind the scenes and thinking of ourselves as content creators is important because how you present yourself, how you market yourself is, is like the bar just keeps going up and up and up, which I know is frustrating and annoying, but I feel like that's kind of what we kind of signed up for when we became business owners. So I think I said, you know, I saw Something where it was on Instagram, but it was, you know, just thinking of filming yourself in different ways. And I think because you are a calligrapher and you're an artist, there's so many ways that you can different angles that you can display your work or how you're working, or even like how you get ready to get your ink out or like when you're mixing the ink or like all of these different things to kind of Tell the story of what you do as an artist. So that's definitely something that I think is here to stay for sure. So maybe not a trend, but something that's that was a trend. That's just something that's going to be here for a while.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

I was just commenting to Elaine, maybe this week or last week about how I feel like as a business owner, I have to be a full time content creator too, but you're right. There's people you can hire who can do that for you. But let's talk about it in the context of weddings too, because I know that like wedding content creators, I feel like that is a kind of up and coming. You know, trend, can you, have you worked with them before? And like, how do you see them as being different than like videographers that people hire and do people hire both?

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, no, I think that's great. Yes, they are different. So we actually had a content creator come on, on our podcast. So a lot of times the content creator is really more someone that has like an iPhone or they call it like iPhone footage or phone footage of the day. So they're really capturing more. kind of raw behind the scenes video that or photos that they're going to, you know, give to the client. Usually it's like a 24 hour turnaround time, which I think is crazy, but it's also like just all of the stills in the video that they capture. They are typically there in addition to the photo and videography team. It is important. To have all of them talk, make sure they're all on the same page, because, you know, back in the day, it was like, make sure that the photo and video guy were, you know, in singing and talking, but now it's like you have to add in this other element. A lot of times, at least from what I have been hearing, I think there are definitely couples that are like, kind of into like the, let's do a fun trend that we saw on Instagram and like, we'll film it and Okay, great. Like maybe you're going to go viral, you know, but I think a lot of times the reason why people are hiring content creators is because they want to be able to experience and relive that day. Really soon, like really fast turnaround time because the day goes by so quickly for them and you don't want them on their phone filming everything or like behind the camera, you know holding the phone. But you still want a way to kind of relive it really, really fast. So I think a lot of the content creators are able to address that. Some will bring a normal camera that they're, they're using to, to fill, but a lot of times it's, you know, a really good iPhone. They'll have a tripod or they'll have like a gimbal the little stand to help them make sure that. It's steady, but it's really something for them to just like kind of have those videos to reflect on their, their day because it did go by so fast.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

And I wonder if there's also a desire to just have it be more like real and raw versus, I feel like the videos from the videography are always like, you're in a movie. There's like slow mo, you know,

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

yeah. And I think that's that's really the big distinction is that they're not going to replace your video team. You're, you know, you're going to what you're going to get from both are very different. It's like they're really short clips, but the video of the videographer, sorry, the videographer is really going to put together that like cinematic feel of like, this is our story and this is our day. And like, this is it's like really the storytelling behind it. Whereas the iPhone or the content creators really like the BTS. This is what was happening. And even like, even with like the angles, it still feels like a very, like a fly on the wall. I was just there enjoying it. And like, this is what we got, you know, and even like, you know, the selfie photos or whatever, like the selfie videos. I think that's, that's what they want. Cause they, they don't want to be the one doing it, but they want someone to help them capture that for them.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

And I feel like the pressure to not have my phone on me would feel so nice on my wedding day. Like if I'm putting myself in that

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yes,

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I don't want my phone or like have to worry about like, Oh, this is such a fun moment. I want to capture it. Like I want my phone out of sight.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah. No, I think it's really, we really want our couples to be in the moment, to live in the moment, to revel in that moment, you know, all those things to really be present. And it doesn't happen when you have a phone in your hand, but you want someone not a bridesmaid, you know, not a maid of honor. You want someone to do it so that, you know, you have that. So I think the next thing the next trend that I would say would be whimsical details, which I think, you know, was kind of becoming a thing in 2024, but it's, it's still going to be around, which, you know, to me that the first thing that I think of as our bows or custom ribbon, I think, you know, people were putting ribbon in their hair or putting bows like as decoration or putting bows in their stationary, or even like the drawings of bows. I think it's going to become even bigger in 2025. And I think that's just kind of a fun, it's like a small detail, but I think it's those little touches, I think, that are fun and can be incorporated in calligraphy as well.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, I actually one of the calligraphers that I'm working with right now in my coaching program, she just shared some photos from a wedding from last year and she did place like place cards on silk ribbon that was like tied around the bottom of wine glasses and it looked so pretty.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

No, I think it's so pretty. And I think it's, you know, it's just people like that personalized touch. So there's so many ways that you can incorporate it as a calligrapher. And I feel like ribbon, you know, it's, I think ribbon is like a, not a luxury, but it's like when people put a ribbon on something, it denotes that it's something special, like a gift or like when you put around a package or whatever, it's just, it just makes something feel more special. So the next trend, like the second to last trend that I think I'm seeing a lot, which I think could something that your listeners could be thinking about is some nostalgia for times past. And I was kind of thinking of like, why is this happening? I think one of the examples that I think, you know, I think Trends or things that people are excited about are cyclical, right? Like things happen in waves. I think with the cottage core trend a couple years ago, I feel like people are kind of yearning or craving that like simpler time before we had all this technology before we had all these ones. So they're kind of like feeling nostalgic for a time. eras gone by. I see with like the old fashioned cakes that are, you know, I feel like in like the 70s you would have like your parents and they would have like those big giant tiered cakes and they have all like the little piping and the icing. I don't, those are definitely coming back and they're like coming back really big, I think. So I think just thinking about how, you know, what trends that I think would have looked dated a couple of years ago, meaning like it was from like the 70s or the 80s. How are those going to come back? Because I think that's kind of the direction that people are going in.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

I had a wedding last year that the theme was like ginger jar.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Oh, yeah,

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

so that kind of like intricate, a little bit old timey pattern. I don't know if that's

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah, I mean, like grandma core became a thing like doilies were a thing. Like I definitely feel like people are wanting like a modern spin on old fashioned stuff,

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. It's like bringing it back in a new and unique way, like bringing something that's nostalgic into a modern time, you know? But I love that point about maybe it's because of all the tech we're constantly surrounded by, especially now with everything AI, that you're just craving something that's familiar, that you can touch,

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

and maybe that's just me because I feel overwhelmed with technology, but I really feel like it's like, Those were the times when it was simpler and life was different. And it's like, it was really sweet that they, you know, had those cakes and they were like covered in icing and all those little like ribbons and the piping and everything. Like, I think there's, I do love like an avant garde cake. That's like really like clean and modern, et cetera. But then I feel like people are really liking those like really fun, old fashioned, like old timey kind of cakes. I wouldn't be surprised if like fashion went back that, you know, like with like the larger sleeves and like, I don't know, who knows.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I feel like flare jeans are back. So

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah. Like my daughter's like, I want flared leggings. And I'm like, I know

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

can have my old ones.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

feel like I was in, I was in like Walmart or somewhere and like all of the clothes there, I was like, I wore that in the nineties, like, I remember literally like this pattern of clothing and now it's back, which is just

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Like I should have never cleaned out my closet from like high school.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

my childhood room, quick tangent, is like a time capsule. Like, I have the beaded curtains, and the inflatable couch, and the magazine, like, you know, of all the teenage heartthrobs that I liked posted on my wall, so,

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

my

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

mean, it's in now. I told my friends, I was like, guys, the 90s are back because American Girl has added like the 90s American Girl to their historical collection. She had like a blow up chair from Delia's, and I was like, I can't. Right.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I remember that.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Great.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

I think we're the nostalgia. Our childhood is the nostalgia now.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Well, I think if you think about it, like we're the ones people in our generation are the ones that are making the purchases and like doing the design. And I think they're, you know, our generation are the thought leaders in fashion. And that's like, you know, and I think that's where you get a lot of the throwback of the fashion, the music. Okay. And then the last trend that I wanted to talk about was private vows, which I think was really great for calligraphers to, to be thinking about because a lot of our couples, you know, because the day does go by so quickly and they just want a moment to kind of breathe and be with each other. So a lot of times they'll do like the first look or the first touch or they'll do sunset portraits, but a lot of our couples, whether or not they have a church ceremony or a ceremony outside or, you know, off property. not in a religious setting, they still will do private vows with each other. One, I think it's really released because they have that time to kind of be with each other, but two, you know, they're, they're reading their vows that they wrote out. And I'm always like, do you want to have somebody write those out for you? Because then, you know, if the videographer is filming it, then they can, you know, I see like the shot where they're reading from it, but then they see like the beautiful handwriting. And it's just something that again, like you can be a part of and incorporate into your repertoire, but also is really giving your couples like something like very special and a keepsake that they're going to keep forever.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Yeah. I feel like the last thing that you want is like the crumpled paper, you know, and that was like folded up in your pocket and like, you're, you know, dressed to the nines, but you're just.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Yeah.

alane_1_01-08-2025_124510:

Holding the crease to computer paper in your hand.

squadcaster-56gc_1_01-08-2025_124510:

I always like, cause I, you know, I, that my couples think it's extra, but I always tell them like, I don't want them reading their speech from their phone. I, you know, they need to send it to me ahead of time. I will print it out. It'll be nice and crisp. It will be waiting for them at their, at their seat. But it's just like, you know, you, When you're photographing it, when you're capturing it, and you're like reliving those moments. And I think, you know, maybe if there's some nostalgia or some sentimental value in like them having written it out, if they have nice handwriting but you know, having someone to, to take the time to like write out those vows, or even like if you write them out and then they have them framed later on or something like that, I think would be really pretty too.

shaochen_1_01-08-2025_104510:

Or even for a lot of my couples, I just make the vow books for them. So when they're being photographed on the outside, it looks nice.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

Let's talk about colors. So obviously colors in general, but also like Pantone every year puts out like a color of the year and that seems to maybe play a part into trends. So 2025s color is mocha mousse, which they describe as a sophisticated brownish taupe or as. Elaine may have called it a poopy brown in case you're wondering what it looks like. So just curious, like, do you see this color playing into weddings? I don't typically see a lot of brownish tones. Right. So I guess like if you do feel like Pantone has like an influence on wedding trends, like how do you see this color potentially being brought into life?

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah. I think when I saw this, I was, I sent it to my stationer friend who's also a calligrapher and I was like, really? I don't, I don't, I don't know. So. I think with the Mocha Mousse and, you know, Pantone declaring a color of the year, I feel like part of it's marketing. I think part of it also is kind of like, just a way for them to be relevant and kind of make a statement. Not in a bad way, but like, this is like a big thing that they always do every year. So we're gonna, you know, you know, make a big deal out of it. And like, then it starts conversations and it's, it's them kind of making themselves relevant in a, we do color way, but how does color reflect or impact everyday life? Right. And so I think for that, I think it's, I really wanted to know, cause usually they'll say like, why are they choosing this color? And I feel like I didn't really read a lot about what made them choose that color. So I think thinking through the Pantones, your question. I don't necessarily know if I see this being Incorporated into real couple's weddings only because brown to me is a seasonal color for like the fall, late fall, winter. So at least for our weddings, a lot of our weddings are going to be spring, summer and early fall because we're outdoors a lot. So it would be harder for us. to incorporate the brown. It doesn't mean that we won't. If there's a bride that's like, I love the mocha moves. I'm like, great, let's figure out. So if she said that, I would probably think, okay, what do you love about it? And then I would think I would probably do like the topes, some natural colors, some dried flowers. I did have, Actually, it was my sister's wedding a couple of years ago. She was in November and we incorporate a lot of textiles into their design. But because it was late November, I knew that the flowers weren't going to be super vibrant, so I incorporated like a brownish taupe color and then there was like an ivory and there was a, a Navy and like a, like a deep berry color. But it did have some brown and it was a more of a taupe and it was incorporated in the flowers. Cause there was some, like, Some dried flowers feelings. There was some Lunaria, which is kind of like a more cream and off white feeling. So I feel like it's, it's like, to me, it inspires that like off white taupe direction. I don't know if people are going to use that, like. Wendy's frosty brown to

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

I thought that's

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

guess.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

good way to describe it.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

But if I were to see it, I could see it in like drapery. I feel like draping is definitely going to be a big thing. But again, it's not like people are going to get brown drapes, but they're going to get that like off white kind of like topi color, I think from the drapes. Again, the flowers, the browns, dried flowers. I could also see it, though, be incorporated in a small ways in twall or in stationary, where there's like a, just a touch where it's like more of like an outline and it's against like an like an ivory or a cream. So it's getting those neutrals, which people love neutrals, but it's not like the star of the show, I think. But I think, you know, as creators and as business owners, I think it doesn't mean that you can't use it because I think one, it's, it gives you content to talk about, you know, how, you know, people are talking about this color. And I think it makes you a thought leader of how can you incorporate this in your work. I'm going to say like, this is how we're going to do it for this wedding, but you know, there's a photo shoot or like even like past work that you had that have may have some Browns in them just to show that it's, it's. Possible or, you know, you can do it or you have flexibility or just, just to kind of like think outside the box of like, you might think it looks like poop, but maybe in this, and it's like shades of this, it kind of looks like, oh, look, it actually looks pretty in this, in this, you know, use. Right?

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

Yeah. That's a really great point is like thinking about how else can you use it? And also thinking outside of just like, this is the color of the year and this is the trend, but thinking about like, okay, let's look at the spectrum here. Like what can we pull out and what can be applicable to our industry specifically?

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah. I definitely feel like there's like some creative license that a lot of people use when they're like, Oh, this is the color. This is what we have. And it's like, well, those are shades of it, which is fine. You know, I don't think everyone, I don't think anyone's going to do mocha mousse envelopes. But maybe for a fall and with like white letter, you know, white ink calligraphy, I think could be really pretty. I don't know.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

We'll see. We'll report back if any of us get requests for mocha mousse envelopes this year.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

I really feel like as, as, you know, business owners, I think this is where it's not like the, the couples are going to be asking for it, but how can we take the conversation that people are having and add to it or give our spin on it to make ourselves look like thought leaders, be thought leaders in the industry.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

Yeah, absolutely. You shared so many great 2025 wedding trends that we can get excited about and look ahead to. And there were so many great ways and ideas that calligraphers specifically can apply those trends to our industry for weddings and events in the year ahead. So one of my questions for you is, you know, as calligraphers, we tend to be. Booked later within the wedding planning process. And we also aren't necessarily getting the full scope of what's going on at the wedding. Whereas like usually the planner, obviously we'll have a good idea. Even photographers, just because of timelines and things like that. Florists. So as calligraphers who are sometimes like at, you know, the. The end of the line, if you will, in the vendor booking process. Do you have any tips for how we can kind of pull some of this one, the information out of our clients for what they have planned, like, for example, do they have private vows planned or, you know, what are they planning to incorporate in their day? And then how could we also maybe start to even plant the seed? With our couples of like, have you noticed this going around? Or what do you think about incorporating something like this into your wedding day and kind of start to approach that conversation with them?

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

I think that's a great question. I definitely think that's probably accurate for what you all are experiencing, but I don't think you should use it as a stumbling block. I think if you are able to, well, first of all, like I think in your social media, you Just show all the different examples of what you're doing and talking about it. And like telling the story of like, so and so we're doing private bows. And so we did this or like, however it is. Like I think starting, you know, planning that seed and talking about it more is really important just to kind of set the tone and inspire them. And then they'll, you know, before they have a call with you, they're probably going to be going on your Instagram or on your website and like seeing this kind of inspiration anyway. So it's already going to be kind of like a way to educate them in advance. But then I think on the call. Whether you're, you, they have a planner or it's just them, I think talking through, you know, asking questions like, can I see your mood board? Or can I see your design plan? What details or moments are you guys really looking forward to? Or like, what's really important to you guys about the wedding to really get an idea of like, This is what, you know, Johnny and Susie are really excited about how can we enhance those special moments for them with calligraphy. And I don't think you necessarily have to give them an example right away. I think if you take all the information that they have, helpfully get like a mood board or, you know, And design plan to see all the kind of like the different vignettes of the day or the different like micro events that are happening. And then when you put together your proposal, here's what you asked for. This is, you know, it's this, but then I, you know, I wanted to suggest some other things that I think could be really fun or make it really special. So here are the bad books or whatever it is, because I think, again, it goes back to that personalization. I think having something to show that you are listening and then here is what I heard and here's what I suggest. Based on our conversation. I think it also enhance your wedding day. I think could be really helpful for you and them.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

Yeah, absolutely. I feel like these are such great tips and I love that you started with educating your audience and kind of planting the seed, because I think as calligraphers, we know exactly what we do and kind of to your point in the very beginning where you're like, I don't follow a ton of planners. It's like, we, you know, we are following other people in our industry.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Mm hmm.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

So I think there's this kind of assumption that our clients know what we offer and what we're capable of doing. But I remember a few years ago being on a console call and somebody being like, Oh, I didn't realize you did that. And I was like, Oh, I'm not doing a good enough job of showcasing everything that is possible when you work with me and what I specialize in or what I'm able to offer because people didn't realize that I can offer the full suite of Day of details. And so I think it's just making sure that you are always putting yourself kind of in your client's shoes and remembering, that like your client hasn't gotten married before, most likely, so it's your job to show like what you are capable of doing or what's possible, or even if it's just like inspiration ideas that you're. posting on your stories or doing a reel or a carousel post of like, this is what I'm really loving in 2025. And I'm looking for couples who want to work with me on these types of things. I'm like putting it out there.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah. I think that's a really good point. It's the same with wedding planners. Not all wedding planners have the same skillset or the same offerings, same thing with calligraphers. Like some people do this and people do that. And so I think making sure that you're talking about those things that you are really excited about, or, you know, different things that you offer can also distinguish you from other people and also educate them of like, they do this, but we do this I think is really helpful.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

I'm glad you brought that point up because I was thinking that too. Like we all have very different businesses and it's our job to make sure our clients know what we do. We can't just assume that they like read minds or even like read our website in detail, you know? Um, but also asking these questions, like Desiree is talking about, this is kind of the key to helping you build like bigger proposals, book, larger clients, so like, don't just take what they come to you at face value with. Like if they email you and say, I want a welcome sign. Do that discovery, ask them what else they need. That's where you can start talking about the other things that you do, that you can offer for them and how you can build bigger packages with incorporating calligraphy for that client.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah, I agree. And even if you're saying, you know usually, like, when we have a discovery call or a console, you know, we'll, we'll go through and we'll listen to what they what they want, what they hear, whatever. And even at the end, these are all the other things that we offer to I think these would be great, even just showing them like, here are the, you know, here are all the different Varieties of that, or, you know, ways that we can, we can provide calligraphy services. It's just that saying it multiple times and them seeing it, I think is also just, it's important for educating them too, because they, it, it takes some, some repetition for them to get to actually hear it. So I think one thing I just wanted to note was that, you know, one of my favorite parts of the design process is collaborating with our vendors. And so I have ideas, you know, I kind of, you know, know where I think we're going to go and the overall direction, but I really love it. Honestly, I really. Almost expect it from the good vendors where if I have an idea, I want you to propose other ideas or other ways of doing something because, you know, I'm not a calligraphy expert. I don't know everything that there is about the inks or the different mediums you can go on or whatever. And so I think, you know, Having you, you know, I want to encourage our listeners to, to be to not be afraid to speak up and make suggestions and say, Hey, you know, I hear this, but there's a new technique I want to try, or there's something new and different that I want to do. Like, how, what do you think about that? I think having that collaborative process and you also showing your value, I think will make the planner or client feel like you're, you're listening, but you're also bringing something new to the experience.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

That's probably one of the, my main takeaways actually from your interview is I've heard you say the word thought leader several times. And I think that's something that like we as calligraphers and our, like our listeners and all business owners in general, we kind of need that reminder sometimes that like, we are the expert at what we do. I think a lot of us feel imposter syndrome, but we have to remember that like. We know more about calligraphy and our specialty and the work that we do about our clients and even more than the planners, right? And as a vendors, we need to step into that and be really confident that we're bringing that expertise and speak up like you said.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah, no, I think it's, yeah, exactly what you said, because I'm not the expert and I think when a planner or a client really tries to put those, those restrictions on a vendor, I think it's really hard. I think you're not excited to do that work. You're like, okay, you know, here, but if it's something that you really want to do, I think it just makes the collaboration. I think, I feel like that's where the magic happens really is when, when you are able to contribute and you're excited about something.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

Yeah, absolutely. Well, Desiree, I feel like you just shared a wealth of knowledge with us from everything from wedding trends to just like, like Xiao Chen just said, to kind of owning your expertise within your industry, which I feel like is going to be so much value to people. So can you please just share with our listeners where they can find you if they want to follow along, follow you for some wedding trends.

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. I feel like we had such a great conversation and I'm really excited for your listeners to hear and hear their thoughts on it. I mostly hang out on Instagram, so Verve event co. That's V-E-R-V-E event CO on Instagram. My podcast is the Ask Ask the Planner podcast on Instagram. And obviously there's online, but can't wait to connect with you all.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

We'll be sure to drop all of that into the show notes. And also if you're a calligrapher who wants to get started working with wedding clients, I also have a free master class that will show you how to do that. And so I'll link that in the show notes as well.

alane_2_01-08-2025_133538:

Thank you, Desiree.

shaochen_2_01-08-2025_113538:

Thank you!

squadcaster-56gc_2_01-08-2025_133539:

Thank you so much for having me on this episode. It was so much fun chatting with you both.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Alane Gianetti

Host
Head Shot

Shaochen Wu

Host